For all you little trusting sheep...How much more do I have to show you before you believe me ?

I thought we were sheeple because we're too brainwashed to accept the truth that the government blew up the world trade center, blew up the OK City building, and shot up the Colorado theater.
How does this story relate to that?

Speaking as a sheeple, the fact that things which are supposed to be beneficial to our health can have dire negative consequences is not only totally plausible but has already been demonstrated with pharmaceuticals which have had to be pulled of the market because they cause heart attacks and strokes.

So I'm just a word trade center, OK City building and Colorado theater shooting sheeple. Not a sheeple on everything.

Teo, if modern foods and medicines and medical treatments are so much of an abomination, how come life expectancy has gone from 48 years in 1900 to over 75 now?

Those figures a conspiracy too?

It sure isn't because we're all fit and trim and exercising regularly.

EricEricson wrote:

Teo, if modern foods and medicines and medical treatments are so much of an abomination, how come life expectancy has gone from 48 years in 1900 to over 75 now?

Those figures a conspiracy too?

It sure isn't because we're all fit and trim and exercising regularly.

It's obviously a trick. The trilateral commission made us live longer to get our trust and confidence. When all along they were double crossing us and fattening us up for the kill.

Think about this. The terrorist attacks took place on Sept 11th. Sept is the ninth month of the year. Nine is two less than eleven and two less than nine would be seven. The number eleven rhymes with the number seven and the number two rhymes with the word Jew. Could it be that Al Qaeda is PART OF A JEWISH CONSPIRACY? You decide.

EricEricson wrote:

Teo, if modern foods and medicines and medical treatments are so much of an abomination, how come life expectancy has gone from 48 years in 1900 to over 75 now?

Those figures a conspiracy too?

It sure isn't because we're all fit and trim and exercising regularly.

Simle answer is sanitation....less horse manure and people manure breeding disease. That along with cleaner water, which is rapidly going back to nasty.

TEOTWAWKI wrote:

Simle answer is sanitation....less horse manure and people manure breeding disease. That along with cleaner water, which is rapidly going back to nasty.

That might have been true for horse manure pre 1930 (life expectancy 59), but I don't buy the people manure aspect. You might be able to make a good argument for people manure in third-world countries that still use night-soil and don't have clean water for flushing and hand washing, but not in the US.

One other factor is that they factor in death at childbirth in the old figures. There is a huge decrease in deaths by children under 1 year old. This again is due to better birthing techniques and sanitation.

The deaths of babies shifted the numbers on the bell curve you are pointing at... Many many people lived to quite old in the 1800s...

Fact is a couple of doctors invented birthing tongs and made a fortune by keeping them hidden from the general public and making a name for themselves as the best at delivering babies.

And you don't think infant mortality has anything to do with better medical care?

Teo, I know you have good reason to distrust doctors and are generally distrusting of foodstocks, but you cannot ignore the 800 pound gorilla in the room. Medical advances HAVE improved our lives and our life spans.

Sure, there are side effects to meds and problems with some vaccines, but they have saved many, many lives.

EricEricson wrote:

And you don't think infant mortality has anything to do with better medical care?

Not really unless the great MAGNIFICENT discovery by Dr.Lister that if you washed your hands between examining patients you might save them from infection and death...yeah that really took a braniac to figure that out...

TEOTWAWKI wrote:

EricEricson wrote:

And you don't think infant mortality has anything to do with better medical care?

Not really unless the great MAGNIFICENT discovery by Dr.Lister that if you washed your hands between examining patients you might save them from infection and death...yeah that really took a braniac to figure that out...

If sanitation was the only cause of infant mortality, that would be a great argument... but I doubt if it has been a significant factor in US mortality in the last 50 years.

http://dying.about.com/od/pediatriccare/tp/leading_causes_infant_death.htm

Sanitation isn't in the top 5 causes of infant mortality in the US.

EricEricson wrote:

http://dying.about.com/od/pediatriccare/tp/leading_causes_infant_death.htm

Sanitation isn't in the top 5 causes of infant mortality in the US.

That is what I said..IT USED TO BE.

we all know Plato died at
age 84 and Aristotle died at age 62, Thomas Reid died age 86 and Galileo lived
to be 77 Issac Newton 84 and all these famous figures died before 1900. i
could name at least 10 more famous people who lived to be 60-80 years of
age.in-fact heres list of people who lived before 1900 and you can do the math
and see what the average life span of those people were.


here's a cut n paste quote..


Joseph Lister, 1st Baron Lister OM, FRS, PC (5 April 1827 – 10 February 1912

Friedlieb Runge (1797–1867) discovered creosote

What does the age of Plato or Aristotle have to do with the AVERAGE life expectancy of a population???

Nothing!

EricEricson wrote:

What does the age of Plato or Aristotle have to do with the AVERAGE life expectancy of a population???

Nothing!

They were human beings...you are just being illogical and stubborn aren't you....?

By all means do what you think best....

I'm Stubborn? Just because I use logic and science and have a science background, it gives me a certain insight into medical arguments.

I'm not being illogical. If anything, it seems you are paranoid and illogical. If you want to use logic about life expectancy... throw out some logical arguments...

Teo, I'm headed to the store to buy me some veggies to go with the chicken thighs I'm gonna cook on the grill tonight. I sprinkle the thighs with Tony's Cajun Spices, grill/smoke them a while, then wrap them in foil to keep them from getting dry and cook them on the grill a little longer. I try to cook them at 225-275 for several hours.

Man... that's good!

It is. I throw some garlic on it as well as the Tony's. That chicken is really delicious...

I'll get me some Zatarains when I run out of Tony's and give it a try.

My kids spent their first three years in an orphanage in filth you cannot imagine.....apples were used instead of toothbrushes, when they did brush their teeth, the workers lined them up and used a common toothbrush, no soap, baths once a week on a good week, no hand washing....you get the idea...

Now....

While all their classmates, who are slathering themselves in hand sanitizer, are allergic to everything, contract several colds each year, suffer from a few bouts of gastrointestinal diseases every year and get other loathsome diseases like bronchitis or strep....

...in ten plus years they have never had fevers, vomited or had more than two colds between them.

There is something to letting your immune system learn to do its thing.

The amazing thing isn't that chemotherapy kills or alters some healthy cells....it is that in a few short decades doctors have learned how to target, isolate and wipe out malignant cells.

That said, it is remarkable how little we do to prevent it.

SheSurfs wrote:

My kids spent their first three years in an orphanage in filth you cannot imagine.....apples were used instead of toothbrushes, when they did brush their teeth, the workers lined them up and used a common toothbrush, no soap, baths once a week on a good week, no hand washing....you get the idea...

Now....

While all their classmates, who are slathering themselves in hand sanitizer, are allergic to everything, contract several colds each year, suffer from a few bouts of gastrointestinal diseases every year and get other loathsome diseases like bronchitis or strep....

...in ten plus years they have never had fevers, vomited or had more than two colds between them.

There is something to letting your immune system learn to do its thing.

I'll buy that unless it's a constant dose of fecal material in the water or rat droppings leading to dysentery , typhus or typhoid .

SheSurfs wrote:

The amazing thing isn't that chemotherapy kills or alters some healthy cells....it is that in a few short decades doctors have learned how to target, isolate and wipe out malignant cells.

That said, it is remarkable how little we do to prevent it.

They want you to believe that. Seeds, chemo, radition therapy do kill cancer cells but the body burden on those treated can be immediately life threatening. I mean I understand the theory. Cancer cells secrete a chemical that shields them from the bodies defenses so if you NUKE the area around the cancer the bodies defenses go there and start cleaning up the dead cells and perhaps in the blast zone the cancer may be killed. In that process many of the cells may migrate and setup colonies elsewhere. I have seen bone cancer cells growing in people's brains for instance.

As a 13 year survivor of advanced ovarian cancer, I am very greatful for chemotherapy! The drugs that were used on me were taxol and carboplatin. Taxol is a derivative of the Pacific Yew tree and carboplatin is made from platinum. Both occur naturally. They were both highly toxic, but they did the trick, as evidenced by my existence today. I also have two sisters who are cancer survivors, partially because of Taxol. When you are faced with the very real death threat of cancer, I think you become much more open-minded about the options that are placed before you.

I'm truely sorry about your grand baby, Teo. I have grandchildren that I adore, and I can't honestly say I wouldn't feel the same way you do if faced with similar circumstances. But I would bet that more people are saved by modern medicine than succumb to it.